AB7318 Remote Frame (RTR) issue can't communicate with Hamilton Zeus CAN Device

[adonoso]

Hello Kyle, attached is the Comunicator label.
Serial number is A0432DEB, it came with Firmware 1.10 as indicated
(attached picture).
It didn’t work (for our project), so we try to update it yesterday to
the newest found in HMS Support webpage. Through the “Firmware Download
Tp downloaded”, loading “Firmware Update Communicator CAN”, file
“FWP_COMMUNICATOR_CAN_ETHERNET_IP_2PORT_V_1_12_01.fwp” (attached
picture)

All images uploaded in the topic are related to operation with last
firmware installed.
Best regards
Alvaro

[kyle_HMS]

It appears that the bug is still an issue with the latest software. I am not sure if there is any timeline for a fix at this point. I apologize for this and I will try to find out more.

[adonoso]

Hello Kyle, we watched the Zeus CAN device operating with a Siemens Simatic S7 with the module CAN CANOpen 021620-B with no problem, do you have any device like it but working with Rockwell PLC MicroLogix 5700 in Ethernet/IP protocol.

Attached is the datasheet

Best regards

Alvaro

14845735537646.pdf (3.55 MB)

[kyle_HMS]

If you are looking for CANOpen we have the CANOpen model X-gateway:

https://www.anybus.com/support/file-doc-downloads/x-gateway-canopen-specific/?ordercode=AB7306

[adonoso]

Hi Kyle, as mentioned we need CAN. The compatible Siemens gateway posted before is CAN CANOpen and it is already operating with a same Zeus device as ours.

Regards

Alvaro Donoso Y.

[kyle_HMS]

The device that I linked to, the AB7306, will work with the Rockwell PLC and is the same protocol as the CM CANOpen 021620-B which you say works with the Zeus device.

[adonoso]

Yes Kyle, but I read the datasheet and didn’t say anything about Can protocol. It only says that communicate through CANOpen protocol (different to CAN).
The other device described before says it works under both protocols.

Thanks for your information and answers

Alvaro Donoso Y.

[kyle_HMS]

That is strange, the CM CANOpen is a CANOpen device. There is also the CAN@net NT prodcuts which convert CAN to Ethernet if you could use MQTT or something similar.

[adonoso]

Attached are images of general description of both modules, the AB7306 and the 021620-B
Our PLC works with Ethernet/IP protocol so I don’t know if it could work only with EtherNet

Alvaro Donoso Y.

[kyle_HMS]

OK thank you for sharing, I see what you mean. We do have new products coming out that should improve our CAN support. The Anybus EDGE will support CAN and the Communicator 2.0 should also, but unfortunately, I have no timeline at the moment.

What market are you in? Is it South America?

[bost6229]

Hi,

has this been solved? I am implementing a communication protocol between an AB7318 Anybus CAN-Ethernet IP module and a Hamilton Zeus device. My problems is similar to the problem described here. I have figured out how to send a Remote Frame from Anybus to Zeus by using a dynamic produced frame (with a trigger byte). The RTR that should be set is not on bit 4 as the manual described but at bit 5 (2#0010 0000). That worked for me.

The problem that I still have left is receiving Remote Frames from Zeus. I have configured a Consume frame fom this purpose with the correct CAN-ID. When using the CAN Line Listener for monitoring, the remote frames (send from Zeus) arrive on the Anybus, but there is no way of getting this information from the Anybus to the PLC. I have tried a trigger tag, but this does not work, it is not being updated in the PLC. So at the moment, the PLC has no knowledge about Remote Frames being send from Zeus. This is important because the PLC can only send data after a Remote Frame has been send from Zeus.

Any updates regarding this issue?

Many thanks in advance.
Hans

[bost6229]

Attached you will find a picture of my Anybus configuration. Here you can see that I have configured a Consume Frame with a trigger byte. So this setup is not working → Trigger byte is not updated in the PLC when Zeus send a Remote Frame.

[kyle_HMS]

We did release a firmware update to allow you to set a RTR bit in dynamic produce frames.

1.13

[bost6229]

Hi Kyle,

Thanks for the quick response.

I am using FW1.13 and yes, setting the RTR bit 5 (not 4 like it says in your manual) works but the problem is not with SENDING a remote frame (=dynamic produce with RTR bit set) but with RECEIVING a remote frame. How can Anybus inform the PLC that it has reveived a remote frame from the CAN device (Zeus in my case)? Trigger byte does not work, stays at 0 even though the Zeus device sends remote frames (I can see this when listening in the CAN bus).

Any solutions here Kyle?

Thanks,
Hans

[kyle_HMS]

Unfortunately I don’t know the solution to that problem, but it doesn’t mean that there isn’t one. I would advise you to create a support case with HMS, which will put you in touch with one of the Anybus engineers most familiar with that device.

Go to https://mysupport.hms.se to create a case.

[adonoso]

Hello Hans and Kyle. That is an issue, the AB7318 can not activate the trigger byte when it gets the RTR from Zeus (we have been working with AB7318 since early 2020). However we have solved it starting a timer (10mS) after sending the Kick to Zeus. Then everything works fine. We have a Hamilton Zeus system working with this Gateway and bought another one (AB7318) to improve knowledge about communications issues with this pippette. Hope can be useful. Regards

[bost6229]

Thanks Kyle, I will do that.

Best regards,

Hans

[bost6229]

Thanks Adonoso for your great feedback.

I have solved it in the same way as you did. I have added a 50ms delay timer after each kick or sending data. So the PLC basically “assumes” that Zeus sends those Remote Frames when you Kick it or when you send data. You have not experienced any inconsistencies with a timer like that? It seems to work all the time?

Thanks,
Hans

[adonoso]

Hello Hans, Kyle, we rose the RTR problem on 2020, them HMS guys took care of that issue and uploaded the v1.13 upgrade. I think they can also solve this issue kindly upgrading the firmware again.
I also think this issue wil carry a real problem if you work with more than one Hamilton Zeus (not our case), because if you send kicks to many pipettes you will not be able to know if each one received it or whom is ready to receive data.
Kyle please, if it is in your field of influence, be so kind to communicate this to HMS development team. We worked on 2020 with Mikael Mårtensson, who helped us to solve the RTR first problem and upgraded the firmware of the AB7318.

[kyle_HMS]

Hi @adonoso,

I appreciate the feedback. I think I worked with you and Techvalue in Chile last year to bring the RTR issue to Mikael’s attention and the developers were able to fix it with the firmware update. I don’t remember if they were aware of this issue with the trigger byte not updating. I will reach out to Mikael and see if this is being worked on or not currently, and if it’s not, I’ll ask if it’s something they could do with another update.

I will keep you both posted.

Kyle